Greedy bastards refuse 4.5% pay rise.

[M***@DastardlyHQ.org]

I wondered how long it would be before the rail unions start blackmailing
commuters again in 2025. Will Rachel from accounts will just give them whatever
they ask for again?

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/elizabeth-line-strike-train-drivers-da
tes-tfl-b1210922.html

Most employees would be more than happy with a 4.5% rise but not these useless
cunts. A lot of them should just be happy they got paid for doing fuck all
for over a year when the EL opening was delayed but no doubt the unions would
spin that as a time of traumatic uncertainty or some such self serving BS.

Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to or
join a union beats me.

[Robert]

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to or
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

[M***@DastardlyHQ.org]

On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 14:09:25 +0000

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to or
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

They also have a legal right to max working hours - however employers are also
legally entitled to refuse employment unless they waive those rights.

Post by Robert
More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

Did you just steo out of the 1970s? Unions are dinosaurs that can't see the
asteroid coming.

[Charles Ellson]

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 14:09:25 +0000

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to or
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

They also have a legal right to max working hours - however employers are also
legally entitled to refuse employment unless they waive those rights.

Post by Robert
More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

Did you just steo out of the 1970s? Unions are dinosaurs that can't see the
asteroid coming.

Some employers have done excellent impressions of even bigger
dinosaurs over the years.

[Recliner]

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 14:09:25 +0000

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to or
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

They also have a legal right to max working hours - however employers are also
legally entitled to refuse employment unless they waive those rights.

Post by Robert
More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

Did you just steo out of the 1970s? Unions are dinosaurs that can't see the
asteroid coming.

Some employers have done excellent impressions of even bigger
dinosaurs over the years.

One curiosity in this case is that their notional employer is about to
change, from MTR to Govia. But I assume it’s TfL that is the real employer
and will strike whatever deal is done. If MTR was the decision maker, I’m
sure it would happily grant the union whatever it wanted, to avoid strikes
during its short remaining tenure.

So Neil has to decide whom he hates the most, the mayor or ASLEF.

[M***@DastardlyHQ.org]

On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 23:04:40 GMT

Post by Recliner

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 14:09:25 +0000

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to

or

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

They also have a legal right to max working hours - however employers are

also

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
legally entitled to refuse employment unless they waive those rights.

Post by Robert
More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

Did you just steo out of the 1970s? Unions are dinosaurs that can't see the
asteroid coming.

Some employers have done excellent impressions of even bigger
dinosaurs over the years.

One curiosity in this case is that their notional employer is about to
change, from MTR to Govia. But I assume it’s TfL that is the real employer
and will strike whatever deal is done. If MTR was the decision maker, I’m
sure it would happily grant the union whatever it wanted, to avoid strikes
during its short remaining tenure.
So Neil has to decide whom he hates the most, the mayor or ASLEF.

I have little time for either, though to be fair to Khan he has stood up to
union demands in the past but pressure from above might mean he has to
capitulate.

[JMB99]

Post by Charles Ellson
Some employers have done excellent impressions of even bigger
dinosaurs over the years.

Usually the unions that most think of as dinosaurs.

I remember a friend told me some time ago about when he worked in the US
for a time. (At that time) Employers were not allowed to influence
workers choice of whether or not to join a union, the place where he was
working had never been unionised. They took over a company that was
heavily unionised, as I wrote they could influence the workers there so
they flew them all to one of their big plants and just left them to meet
the local staff and talk with them.

None of them chose to join a union.

When I started work I joined the union but all we ever got from them
were letters about the Left wing causes of that time, mostly foreign.
Never saw anyone from the union.

It was in the days when unions could call strikes with bothering to
consult members and there were rumours that they were planning one.

So I wrote to the union resigning.

I got a very sarcastic letter from them, saying that all resignations
had to go through the Branch Secretary, quoting a rule number and
enclosing a copy of the rules.

I wrote back explaining that I had no idea who the Branch Secretary was
because I had never heard anything from him. Also I quoted one of the
rules which said all members should be given a copy of the rules on
joining, I pointed out that I had never received a copy so they had
broken their own rules.

I also pointed out that I had written to Salaries to stop all payments
to the union so I was not bothered whether or not they thought I was
still a member.

I never heard from them again!

[Recliner]

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 14:09:25 +0000

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to or
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

They also have a legal right to max working hours - however employers are also
legally entitled to refuse employment unless they waive those rights.

Post by Robert
More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

Did you just steo out of the 1970s? Unions are dinosaurs that can't see the
asteroid coming.

Some employers have done excellent impressions of even bigger
dinosaurs over the years.

As Neil says, the EL drivers have been well-treated by TfL, keeping their
very well-paid jobs despite being employed in larger numbers than needed,
thanks to COVID and the delayed EL opening. I don’t think they were put on
furlough or suffered any pay cuts.

A normal, private sector employer would not still be offering
above-inflation rises. And yet, despite this generous treatment, they voted
unanimously to strike.

[M***@DastardlyHQ.org]

On Fri, 14 Feb 2025 17:49:39 GMT

Post by Recliner

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
On Thu, 13 Feb 2025 14:09:25 +0000

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
Why there wasn't a stipulation that any new employees could not belong to

or

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org

Post by Robert

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
join a union beats me.

In the UK, employees have the legal right to join a union.

They also have a legal right to max working hours - however employers are

also

Post by Charles Ellson

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
legally entitled to refuse employment unless they waive those rights.

Post by Robert
More industries need to encompass union membership, and then perhaps
employees would work under better conditions. I.T. is a good example.

Did you just steo out of the 1970s? Unions are dinosaurs that can't see the
asteroid coming.

Some employers have done excellent impressions of even bigger
dinosaurs over the years.

As Neil says, the EL drivers have been well-treated by TfL, keeping their
very well-paid jobs despite being employed in larger numbers than needed,
thanks to COVID and the delayed EL opening. I don’t think they were put on
furlough or suffered any pay cuts.
A normal, private sector employer would not still be offering
above-inflation rises. And yet, despite this generous treatment, they voted
unanimously to strike.

Right now in the private sector they'd be grateful just to be keeping their
jobs once the NI rise comes in in April. A payrise would be a fantasy. These
guys are just not reading the room.

[Ulf_Kutzner]

Post by M***@DastardlyHQ.org
I wondered how long

Great.