Wheels outside rails.

[Michel Van den Berghe]

Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.

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[bob]

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2175v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2171v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2170v3.jpg

That's an example of what was once quite common, the plateway. Common in
the very early railways, but fell out of favour because the rails weren't
able to be made strong enough to support the wight of steam locomotives.

Robin

[Christopher A. Lee]

Post by bob

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2175v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2171v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2170v3.jpg

That's an example of what was once quite common, the plateway. Common in
the very early railways, but fell out of favour because the rails weren't
able to be made strong enough to support the wight of steam locomotives.
Robin

Not to mention that the vehicles were steered by the vertical part of
the "rail". The later coned wheel was far better.

[Tim Watts]

Post by Christopher A. Lee

Post by bob

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2175v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2171v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2170v3.jpg

That's an example of what was once quite common, the plateway. Common in
the very early railways, but fell out of favour because the rails weren't
able to be made strong enough to support the wight of steam locomotives.
Robin

Not to mention that the vehicles were steered by the vertical part of
the "rail". The later coned wheel was far better.

And if you want to get really specialist, dockyard cranes on straight
rails can have double flanged wheels.

[furnessvale]

Post by Tim Watts
And if you want to get really specialist, dockyard cranes on straight
rails can have double flanged wheels.

As indeed do some funiculars (on one side only of course) to ensure each car
takes its correct side at passing points.

George

[Anna Noyd-Dryver]

Post by furnessvale

Post by Tim Watts
And if you want to get really specialist, dockyard cranes on straight
rails can have double flanged wheels.

As indeed do some funiculars (on one side only of course) to ensure each car
takes its correct side at passing points.

IMX it's 'most' rather than 'some'. The only one I've been on recently
which wasn't is the Great Orme Tramway (other than those which don't
require pointwork at all, eg Lynton-Lynmouth).


Anna Noyd-Dryver

[Neil Williams]

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver
IMX it's 'most' rather than 'some'. The only one I've been on recently
which wasn't is the Great Orme Tramway (other than those which don't
require pointwork at all, eg Lynton-Lynmouth).

Sometimes the other side even has *no* flanges, and is just a simple
roller, making the "pointwork" simpler still.

Neil

[Recliner]

On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:55:03 +0100, Neil Williams

Post by Neil Williams

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver
IMX it's 'most' rather than 'some'. The only one I've been on recently
which wasn't is the Great Orme Tramway (other than those which don't
require pointwork at all, eg Lynton-Lynmouth).

Sometimes the other side even has *no* flanges, and is just a simple
roller, making the "pointwork" simpler still.

Invariably, on funicular cars with double flanges on one side there's
just a wide roller on the other side. And of course the points have no
moving parts. The outer rails are continuous, while there are wide
gaps on the inner rails (for the cables) that the wide rollers bridge.

Here's an example from the Zugerberg Bahn loop:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/recliner/20009112378/in/album-72157656142850888/lightbox/

[Peter Able]

Post by Recliner
On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:55:03 +0100, Neil Williams

Post by Neil Williams

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver
IMX it's 'most' rather than 'some'. The only one I've been on recently
which wasn't is the Great Orme Tramway (other than those which don't
require pointwork at all, eg Lynton-Lynmouth).

Sometimes the other side even has *no* flanges, and is just a simple
roller, making the "pointwork" simpler still.

Invariably, on funicular cars with double flanges on one side there's
just a wide roller on the other side. And of course the points have no
moving parts. The outer rails are continuous, while there are wide
gaps on the inner rails (for the cables) that the wide rollers bridge.

Was going to say "as discussed recently" - but it's two years ago! Gosh,
how time flies :(

PA

[Anna Noyd-Dryver]

Post by Neil Williams

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver
IMX it's 'most' rather than 'some'. The only one I've been on recently
which wasn't is the Great Orme Tramway (other than those which don't
require pointwork at all, eg Lynton-Lynmouth).

Sometimes the other side even has *no* flanges, and is just a simple
roller, making the "pointwork" simpler still.

Yes, that's the standard arrangement when one wheel is double-flanged.


Anna Noyd-Dryver

[Mark Goodge]

On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 19:30:13 -0000 (UTC), Anna Noyd-Dryver

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver

Post by Neil Williams

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver
IMX it's 'most' rather than 'some'. The only one I've been on recently
which wasn't is the Great Orme Tramway (other than those which don't
require pointwork at all, eg Lynton-Lynmouth).

Sometimes the other side even has *no* flanges, and is just a simple
roller, making the "pointwork" simpler still.

Yes, that's the standard arrangement when one wheel is double-flanged.

Although having both wheels double flanged also means you can have them
loose on the axle, meaning that the concept of "gauge" can be extremely
fluid. For rough and ready trackwork, that's a definite advantage. See, for
example, the Nantlle Railway (which lasted all the way into BR ownership as
a horse drawn double flanged wagonway).

Mark

[s***@walking-tree.org]

Post by Tim Watts
And if you want to get really specialist, dockyard cranes on straight
rails can have double flanged wheels.

as can funiculars, with one wheel being double flanged and the other not
flanged at all. This means you can set up a passing loop without recourse
to moving point blades.

[bob]

Post by Christopher A. Lee

Post by bob

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2175v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2171v3.jpg
http://www.thebw.net/Pic/2016/DSCA2170v3.jpg

That's an example of what was once quite common, the plateway. Common in
the very early railways, but fell out of favour because the rails weren't
able to be made strong enough to support the wight of steam locomotives.

Not to mention that the vehicles were steered by the vertical part of
the "rail". The later coned wheel was far better.

It was better for vehicles dedicated to rail use, but the benefit of the
flanged plateway is that the same wagon for use on the plateway could run
on the same wheels on other surfaces as a conventions wagon. For the kind
of industrial applications of the day this was seen as a significant
benefit.

Robin

[d***@yahoo.co.uk]

On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 06:29:45 -0000 (UTC), bob <***@gmail.com>
wrote:
ives.

Post by bob

Post by Christopher A. Lee
Not to mention that the vehicles were steered by the vertical part of
the "rail". The later coned wheel was far better.

It was better for vehicles dedicated to rail use, but the benefit of the
flanged plateway is that the same wagon for use on the plateway could run
on the same wheels on other surfaces as a conventions wagon. For the kind
of industrial applications of the day this was seen as a significant
benefit.
Robin

And a form of them has made a comeback with guided busways though the
steering of the bus is done in a more sophisticated way than just
letting the weight carrying wheels bear against the vertical
section,though I suppose in the rare event a guided bus having to
reverse a reasonable distance the rear wheels would do that.

G.Harman

[Peter Able]

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.

Usually wheels are ON the rails with a flange between the rails. These are
flangless wheels with the rails being purely guide rails.

PA

[Anna Noyd-Dryver]

Post by Peter Able

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.

Usually wheels are ON the rails with a flange between the rails. These are
flangless wheels with the rails being purely guide rails.

One of the Swiss mountain rack railways (Pilatus Bahn) has conventional
wheels but with outside flanges! It's what I was half expecting to see in
the first post of this thread.


Anna Noyd-Dryver

[Peter Able]

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver

Post by Peter Able

Post by Michel Van den Berghe
Usually, wheels are between the rails. But in Brecon, rails where
between the wheels.

Usually wheels are ON the rails with a flange between the rails. These are
flangless wheels with the rails being purely guide rails.

One of the Swiss mountain rack railways (Pilatus Bahn) has conventional
wheels but with outside flanges! It's what I was half expecting to see in
the first post of this thread.

Me too - or the case covered in uk.railway recently where the wheels on one
side were double-flanged and on the other side just flangeless rollers.

PA