Headcodes

[Clive]

I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?

[Paul Scott]

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I was
at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?

I'd say the system has changed a lot. A subset of letters may have at one
time (under BR) defined an interregional train's final destination region,
but I don't think there has ever been an accurate correlation of 'letter to
city'. If the GW used A for London it wouldn't necessarily follow that
everyone used A for London; especially if they were running into multiple
terminals.

Certain descriptions will suggest that for instance a '1S' must be a
'Scottish Express' - but it could just as easily be a Waterloo - Woking
commuter service AFAICS...

Paul

[The Iron Jelloid]

Post by Paul Scott

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each
destination having it's own letter apart from specials which normally
carried a "Z". Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the
letters for the headcodes of cities around the country?

I'd say the system has changed a lot. A subset of letters may have at
one time (under BR) defined an interregional train's final destination
region, but I don't think there has ever been an accurate correlation
of 'letter to city'. If the GW used A for London it wouldn't
necessarily follow that everyone used A for London; especially if they
were running into multiple terminals.
Certain descriptions will suggest that for instance a '1S' must be a
'Scottish Express' - but it could just as easily be a Waterloo - Woking
commuter service AFAICS...

ISTR there was a rule (or at least a policy) that where the same letter
was used for different routes / areas, it had to be done so there was no
chance of confusion - so a signaller would always know instantly what
any given code meant. 1Exx were inter-regional trains to the Eastern
Region when I was out bashing, which probably meant that the E codes
wouldn't be used by the LMR at all, and if used by WR, SR, or ScR, would
be kept to services which wouldn't share track or stations with anything
that could be an express to the Eastern Region.

I think the ScR used 1Oxx (or was it 1Pxx?) for the Edinburgh - Glasgow
expresses, ISTR it was also used on the Southern - no chance of the two
sets of services ever conflicting.

From dim memories of the 1Hxx books, the inter-regional codes were:

xSxx - to the Scottish Region
xExx - to the Eastern Region
xMxx - to the London Midland Region
xVxx - to the Western Region

an I can't remember what the SR version was!

Interesting that the Western was V and not W, can anyone remember why?

And Z was for specials. And 1X01 for the Royal Train.

[Yokel]

Post by The Iron Jelloid

Post by Paul Scott

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each
destination having it's own letter apart from specials which normally
carried a "Z". Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the
letters for the headcodes of cities around the country?

I'd say the system has changed a lot. A subset of letters may have at
one time (under BR) defined an interregional train's final destination
region, but I don't think there has ever been an accurate correlation
of 'letter to city'. If the GW used A for London it wouldn't
necessarily follow that everyone used A for London; especially if they
were running into multiple terminals.
Certain descriptions will suggest that for instance a '1S' must be a
'Scottish Express' - but it could just as easily be a Waterloo - Woking
commuter service AFAICS...

ISTR there was a rule (or at least a policy) that where the same letter
was used for different routes / areas, it had to be done so there was no
chance of confusion - so a signaller would always know instantly what
any given code meant. 1Exx were inter-regional trains to the Eastern
Region when I was out bashing, which probably meant that the E codes
wouldn't be used by the LMR at all, and if used by WR, SR, or ScR, would
be kept to services which wouldn't share track or stations with anything
that could be an express to the Eastern Region.
I think the ScR used 1Oxx (or was it 1Pxx?) for the Edinburgh - Glasgow
expresses, ISTR it was also used on the Southern - no chance of the two
sets of services ever conflicting.
xSxx - to the Scottish Region
xExx - to the Eastern Region
xMxx - to the London Midland Region
xVxx - to the Western Region
an I can't remember what the SR version was!
Interesting that the Western was V and not W, can anyone remember why?
And Z was for specials. And 1X01 for the Royal Train.

The only error is the past tense. These codes are still in use (the
last vestige of BR as they still mark the old regional boundaries) and
the Southern one is "xOxx". I don't know about the Royal Train, but
1Z99 is still used for a rescue loco or train which must be given
priority to clear the line.

"X" is normally only used for trains which run under special
restrictions, for example they might be barred from certain lines or be
out-of-gauge so other traffic must not be allowed to pass them between
specified points. All signalboxes on the line of route will be faxed
the details and the signaller must check the restrictions before
accepting such a train or setting a route for it through his area.

"Y" is used for trains not using the normal route between two points,
for example in the Southampton area the Southern services which run
between Southampton and Brighton via Eastleigh rather than the direct
route via Swanwick run as "1Yxx" so the signaller knows which way to
send them at St Denys and Fareham.

"Z" is not only used for specials, but also for additional trains to the
normal timetable. A very common situation is where a train is "split"
by engineering work en route with a bus for part of the journey. One
train will carry the "normal" code, the other portion will run with a
"Z" replacing the normal letter. Normally, the portion which runs to
the normal or near normal timetable will keep the original code whilst
the revised service to connect with the buses takes the "Z" - but if
there is a lot of engineering work about this might have to be altered
to avoid too many "Z"s running round in one area.

In recent decades, the number of train services has proliferated to the
point that many of these codes are now used for local as well as
interregional services. For example, in the Southampton area 1Exx is
used for XC services to/from Newcastle whilst 2Exx are used for the
Portsmouth "stoppers".

Sometimes interregional services have expanded to the point where they
have had to be given local codes. An awful lot now run between the
Southern and Western "regions" and there are nowhere near enough "O"s
and "V"s to go round. So Cardiff-Portmouth services now run as 1Fxx,
whilst the few remaining FGW to/from Brighton services still run as "O"
and "V".

There are many other anomalies. All trains from Southampton and
Portsmouth to Victoria via Horsham are 1Cxx, but those going in the
other direction are 1Cxx for Portsmouth and 1Jxx for Southampton, the
orginal system of them all being 1Cxx but having numbers below 50 for
Portsmouth and above 50 for Southampton having to be altered after a
number of mis-routings at Farlington Junction.

Some intensive suburban routes go "round the clock" so the same train ID
can be seen at different times of day. But what should not happen is
the same code appearing on two different trains in the same signalbox
area at the same time. So many systems, including the public
information systems and other systems that automatically route or
regulat trains, now use these codes that two copies running around in
the same area causes a fair amount of confusion.

[Anna Noyd-Dryver]

Post by Yokel
Some intensive suburban routes go "round the clock" so the same train ID
can be seen at different times of day. But what should not happen is the
same code appearing on two different trains in the same signalbox area at
the same time. So many systems, including the public information systems
and other systems that automatically route or regulat trains, now use
these codes that two copies running around in the same area causes a fair
amount of confusion.

One of fNW's driver diagrams in the early 2000s consisted of
Manc-Crewe-Airport-Crewe-Deansgate-OxfRd (Break at OxfRd)
-Crewe-Airport-Crewe-Deansgate-OxfRd (travel to Picc) Picc-Alderley
Edge-Picc. All three Machester-bound trains were 2H25!!


Anna Noyd-Dryver

[Yokel]

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver

Post by Yokel
Some intensive suburban routes go "round the clock" so the same train ID
can be seen at different times of day. But what should not happen is the
same code appearing on two different trains in the same signalbox area at
the same time. So many systems, including the public information systems
and other systems that automatically route or regulat trains, now use
these codes that two copies running around in the same area causes a fair
amount of confusion.

One of fNW's driver diagrams in the early 2000s consisted of
Manc-Crewe-Airport-Crewe-Deansgate-OxfRd (Break at OxfRd)
-Crewe-Airport-Crewe-Deansgate-OxfRd (travel to Picc) Picc-Alderley
Edge-Picc. All three Machester-bound trains were 2H25!!
Anna Noyd-Dryver

If my going home train (1439 Waterloo-Brockenhurst) is more than a
couple of minutes late so the 1550 Poole - Waterloo has made it to
Totton and cleared the displays at Ashurst, I can alight from a unit
which forms the "First train" displayed on *both* platforms at Ashurst
New Forest, as it forms the next stopping train up from Brockenhurst to
Southampton Central.

How many other instances of this type can the august contributors to
this newsgroup come up with, excluding the obvious ones such as "one
train" branches (so the Lymington branch won't count) and routes with
such an infrequent service that for most of the time there is only one
train on them?

[D7666]

Post by Yokel
If my going home train (1439 Waterloo-Brockenhurst) is more than a
couple of minutes late so the 1550 Poole - Waterloo has made it to
Totton and cleared the displays at Ashurst, I can alight from a unit
which forms the "First train" displayed on *both* platforms at Ashurst
New Forest, as it forms the next stopping train up from Brockenhurst to
Southampton Central.
How many other instances of this type can the august contributors to
this newsgroup come up with, excluding the obvious ones such as "one
train" branches (so the Lymington branch won't count) and routes with
such an infrequent service that for most of the time there is only one
train on them?

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm interesting question

I had to sit and figure that one out fir a bit, got it now.

In the mean time i shall throw in the completely useless remark that
when it was Lyndhurst Road thats where my grans railway career began
before moving to the level crossing position at South Charford
mentioned in a different thread recently.

--
Nick

[D7666]

Post by D7666

Post by Yokel
If my going home train (1439 Waterloo-Brockenhurst) is more than a
couple of minutes late so the 1550 Poole - Waterloo has made it to
Totton and cleared the displays at Ashurst, I can alight from a unit
which forms the "First train" displayed on *both* platforms at Ashurst
New Forest, as it forms the next stopping train up from Brockenhurst to
Southampton Central.
How many other instances of this type can the august contributors to
this newsgroup come up with, excluding the obvious ones such as "one
train" branches (so the Lymington branch won't count) and routes with
such an infrequent service that for most of the time there is only one
train on them?

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm interesting question
I had to sit and figure that one out fir a bit, got it now.
In the mean time i shall throw in the completely useless remark that
when it was Lyndhurst Road thats where my grans railway career began
before moving to the level crossing position at South Charford
mentioned in a different thread recently.
--
Nick

I would suggest a near-similar scenario could occur at Hampden Park on
those workings that call their both ways in and out of Eastbourne, but
would only happen at certain times of the day when traffic is lighter.

However your scenario is a more complex one of train A forming train
B, and not the same train, so my answer is outside the terms of
reference.

I then think of Watlington one station out of Kings Lynn, its double
track station, the hourly off peak northbound service at mostly xx:11
gets to Lynn at xx:20 dep xx:56 Watlington xx:03. does that comply ?



--
Nick

[Yokel]

Post by D7666

Post by D7666

Post by Yokel
If my going home train (1439 Waterloo-Brockenhurst) is more than a
couple of minutes late so the 1550 Poole - Waterloo has made it to
Totton and cleared the displays at Ashurst, I can alight from a unit
which forms the "First train" displayed on *both* platforms at Ashurst
New Forest, as it forms the next stopping train up from Brockenhurst to
Southampton Central.
How many other instances of this type can the august contributors to
this newsgroup come up with, excluding the obvious ones such as "one
train" branches (so the Lymington branch won't count) and routes with
such an infrequent service that for most of the time there is only one
train on them?

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm interesting question
I had to sit and figure that one out fir a bit, got it now.
In the mean time i shall throw in the completely useless remark that
when it was Lyndhurst Road thats where my grans railway career began
before moving to the level crossing position at South Charford
mentioned in a different thread recently.
--
Nick

I would suggest a near-similar scenario could occur at Hampden Park on
those workings that call their both ways in and out of Eastbourne, but
would only happen at certain times of the day when traffic is lighter.
However your scenario is a more complex one of train A forming train
B, and not the same train, so my answer is outside the terms of
reference.
I then think of Watlington one station out of Kings Lynn, its double
track station, the hourly off peak northbound service at mostly xx:11
gets to Lynn at xx:20 dep xx:56 Watlington xx:03. does that comply ?
--
Nick

If that's the only service about, then it's too easy as most such lines
will have this situation near the terminal station. Effectively you
have a section with "one train" working, although I know that the King's
Lynn line can handle a number of trains at a time.

In the Ashurst (New Forest) scenario, there are a further three
passenger trains passing the "down" platform (one of which calls there)
and and three "run pasts" on the "up" before the return working
arrives. But, as I admitted, it does require a slight delay to the
"down" train for these displays to be seen.

[d***@yahoo.co.uk]

Post by D7666

Post by Yokel
How many other instances of this type can the august contributors to
this newsgroup come up with, excluding the obvious ones such as "one
train" branches (so the Lymington branch won't count) and routes with
such an infrequent service that for most of the time there is only one
train on them?

hmmmmmmmmmmmmm interesting question
I had to sit and figure that one out fir a bit, got it now.
In the mean time i shall throw in the completely useless remark that
when it was Lyndhurst Road thats where my grans railway career began
before moving to the level crossing position at South Charford
mentioned in a different thread recently.

Which was in a reply to me.
To which I'll respond with the equally useless remark that Lyndhurst
Road was a station I commuted to Romsey from when I first moved to
Hants. My landlady had been in Ashurst a long time and could remember
the crossing before the bridge was built,camping coaches at the
station and when the Happy cheese was Angry,could still see the
writing on the old building back 35 years ago. The road I lived in is
possibly where Yokel lives,the building later became a hostel for
single mothers and they never did fix the leaking roof.
Now't to do with railways but just shows how circles of lives can
easily interconnect.

G.Harman

[Ross]

Post by Anna Noyd-Dryver

Post by Yokel
Some intensive suburban routes go "round the clock" so the same train ID
can be seen at different times of day. But what should not happen is the
same code appearing on two different trains in the same signalbox area at
the same time. So many systems, including the public information systems
and other systems that automatically route or regulat trains, now use
these codes that two copies running around in the same area causes a fair
amount of confusion.

One of fNW's driver diagrams in the early 2000s consisted of
Manc-Crewe-Airport-Crewe-Deansgate-OxfRd (Break at OxfRd)
-Crewe-Airport-Crewe-Deansgate-OxfRd (travel to Picc) Picc-Alderley
Edge-Picc. All three Machester-bound trains were 2H25!!

Until about 1993 all journeys on the Stourbridge Town Car ran as 2H66.

There were a lot of 2H66's... :)

[Neil Williams]

Post by Ross
Until about 1993 all journeys on the Stourbridge Town Car ran as 2H66.

Before the new PIS was installed in the late 90s all Merseyrail
trains to a given destination had the same reporting number so that
the old Solari PIS was triggered to show the correct destination.

Neil

[Peter Masson]

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers ECML
train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I was at
Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination having
it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z". Is the
old system now defunct? If not what are the letters for the headcodes of
cities around the country?

The BR Regions live on. For an inter-regional train
E destination in Eastern Region
M destination in London Midland Region
S destination in Scottish Region
V destination in Western Region
O destination in Southern Region

So 1Exx on a train to Kings Cross suggests that its origin was in another
Region - almost certainly a train from Scotland.

Peter

[D7666]

Post by Peter Masson
The BR Regions live on. For an inter-regional train
E destination in Eastern Region
M destination in London Midland Region
S destination in Scottish Region
V destination in Western Region
O destination in Southern Region

One good reason for retaining this is it offers demarcation between
different area of the land to duplicate numbers (becasue there are not
enough in the converntion for all trains to have a unique identifier)
i.e. keeping ECML with 1Exx Scotland -> England and 1Sxx v.v. allows
one series of 1Axx to be used south of Newcastle and the same range
north of somewhere north of Newcastle where trains in series never
meet each other. If you made all (GN)ER main line train into KX 1A,
you'd block different use of 1A around Edinburgh and Glasgow.

--
Nick

[D7666]

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E".   When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct?   If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?
--
Clive

Not cities.

Back in time, the letters, apart from E M O S V (inter regionals
usually but not always) Z (specials *usually* inter regional specials)
X (as far as passegner trains concerned, royal train). BR SR for
example certainly used S in Kent while ISTR BR ScR Edin-Glas used O (I
think).

The other letters were not cities / towns / stations but usually [not
always] destination BR operating divisions thus B did not mean
destination Bristol but destination anywhere in Bristol division
likewise on WR A was London Division not just Paddington. On LMR A was
also London Division (WCML) not just euston and IIRC on ER London
division ECML not just Kings Cross. The same sort of principle applies
still today, just there are many more trains and the regions don't
exist.

These letters and even numbers to the extent of the first digit have
drifted in meaning over time, but a divisional legacy is traceable
through most of them, except where something wholly new has come on
the scene, like Eurostar or Thameslink or LO .

As usual with these things there was a general principle but no set
rule, you can find exceptions to prove rules however you look at this
subject, by number or by service or by location.

--
Nick

[Graeme Wall]

Post by D7666

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?
--
Clive

Not cities.
Back in time, the letters, apart from E M O S V (inter regionals
usually but not always) Z (specials *usually* inter regional specials)
X (as far as passegner trains concerned, royal train). BR SR for
example certainly used S in Kent while ISTR BR ScR Edin-Glas used O (I
think).
The other letters were not cities / towns / stations but usually [not
always] destination BR operating divisions thus B did not mean
destination Bristol but destination anywhere in Bristol division
likewise on WR A was London Division not just Paddington. On LMR A was
also London Division (WCML) not just euston and IIRC on ER London
division ECML not just Kings Cross. The same sort of principle applies
still today, just there are many more trains and the regions don't
exist.
These letters and even numbers to the extent of the first digit have
drifted in meaning over time, but a divisional legacy is traceable
through most of them, except where something wholly new has come on
the scene, like Eurostar or Thameslink or LO .
As usual with these things there was a general principle but no set
rule, you can find exceptions to prove rules however you look at this
subject, by number or by service or by location.
--
Nick

The original system introduce in April 1966 was as follows:

Interregional Trains

E Eastern Region (GN, GE & LT&S Lines)
M London Midland Region
N Eastern Region (NE lines)
O Southern Region
S Scottish Region
V Western Region
X Excursion and Special Trains

Western Region

A London Division
B Bristol Division (Bristol District)
C Bristol Division (Plymouth District)
F Cardiff Division (Swansea District)
T Cardiff Division (Cardiff District)
Z Excursion, Military and Special Trains running within the WR

London Midland Region

A London Division (LNW)
B London Division (GC & NL)
C London Division (Midland)
Manchester Division (North-LNW)
D Stoke-on-Trent Division (N Wales)
Nottingham Division (Nottingham)
F Nottingham Division (Leicester)
Liverpool Division
G Birmingham Division (LM)
H Birmingham Dividion (GW)
Manchester Division (South)
J Stoke-on-Trent Division (Shrewsbury)
Manchester Division (North-L&Y)
K Stoke-on-Trent Division (Stoke)
P Nottingham Division (Derby)
T Excursion & Special trains local to LMR
or freight on trip working
Z Special trains

Eastern Region (This gets complicated - Ed)

Common Letters

A ECML passenger trains
F Special train to the ECML not traversing LMR lines
T Cross London freight trip workings
X Royal Trains or out-of-gauge or exceptional loads
Z (Even numbers) Special trains local to the ER
Z (odd numbers) Special trains traversing LMR lines

North Eastern Lines

B York District
C Wakefield District
D Middlesbrough District
G Newcastle Division
H Hull Division
L Leeds Division

Great Northern Line

B Kings Cross/Hitchin/Cambridge
B Barnetby (exclusive)/Scunthorpe/Doncaster (exclusive)/
Hexthorpe Jn
C Hitchin (exclusive)/Grantham
D Doncaster Area (except where covered by B)
G Sheffield (GC) Area
H Sheffield (LM) Area/Tinsley Yard
J March/Boston/Lincoln/Newark (Castle)/
Bottesford (West)
K Firsby/Skegness/Louth
L Grimsby/Cleethorpes
P Boston/New Holland/Immingham

Great Eastern Line

A Guidea Park/Romford
B Brentwood/Shenfield/Chelsmford
C Peterborough/Whittlesea
C Ilford/Ilford CS
D Southend (Victoria)/Southminster branches
F Chelmsford (exclusive)/Ipswich (exclusive)
and branches (Except Chappel)
G Norwich/Sproughton/Bury (Exclusive)/Thetford/
Dereham (exclusive)
H Temple Mills/Stratford/North Woolwich/
Poplar/Spitalfields
J March/Wisbech/Boston/Lincoln/Newark (Castle)/
Bottesford (West)
K Ipswich/Lowestoft/Sheringham/Norwich (exclusive)
and branches
L Bishops Stortford (exclusive)/Hunstanton/Dereham/
Brandon/Bury (inclusive)/Marks Tey (exclusive)
M Enfield Town/Hackney Downs
N Chingford/Hackney Downs (exclusive)
O Broxbourne (exclusive)/Bishops Stortford via Edmonton
P Tottenham/Broxbourne/Hertford East via Lea Valley
S Broxbourne (exclusive)/Bishops Stortford via Lea Valley
V Cheshunt/Broxbourne/Hertford East via Edmonton

LT&S (Used numbers rather than letters)

1 Down trains via Upminster line
2 Up trains via Upminster line
3 Down trains via Tilbury line
4 Up trains via Tilbury line
5 Trains to and from East Ham depot
6 Down Tottenham & Hampstead trains terminating at Barking
All up Tottenham & Hampstead line trains
7 Ockenden branch
8 Up trains via Forest gate Jn
9 Trains terminating at Ripple Lane

Scottish Region

Glasgow Central, elsewhere only used 2-character codes

A Diesel Service via Larkfield
B Electric Service via Larkfield
C Diesel Service via Muirhead Jn & Circle Lines
D Diesel Service via Clydesdale Line at Shields Jn
E Electric Service via Muirhead Jn & Circle Lines
G Diesel Services via Glasgow, Barrhead & Kilmarnock Lines
H Diesel Service & Ayrshire Lines via Paisley Canal
K Diesel Service & Gourock or Wemyss Bay
L Electric Service & Gourock or Wemyss Bay
P Diesel Service & Ayrshire Lines via Paisley (Gilmour St)
T Diesel Service via City Lines at Sheilds Jn

Southern Region

2-character codes
7

[The Gardener]

On Feb 13, 6:19 pm, Graeme Wall <***@greywall.demon.co.uk> wrote:

<snipped>

Thanks for this info - very useful!

In addition, L was later (and still is) used for inter-Regional trains
to the former Anglia Region.

[Jack Taylor]

< snip >
Eastern Region (This gets complicated - Ed)
Common Letters
A ECML passenger trains
F Special train to the ECML not traversing LMR lines
T Cross London freight trip workings
X Royal Trains or out-of-gauge or exceptional loads
Z (Even numbers) Special trains local to the ER
Z (odd numbers) Special trains traversing LMR lines
North Eastern Lines
B York District
C Wakefield District
D Middlesbrough District
G Newcastle Division
H Hull Division
L Leeds Division
Great Northern Line
B Kings Cross/Hitchin/Cambridge
B Barnetby (exclusive)/Scunthorpe/Doncaster (exclusive)/Hexthorpe Jn
C Hitchin (exclusive)/Grantham
D Doncaster Area (except where covered by B)
G Sheffield (GC) Area
H Sheffield (LM) Area/Tinsley Yard
J March/Boston/Lincoln/Newark (Castle)/Bottesford (West)
K Firsby/Skegness/Louth
L Grimsby/Cleethorpes
P Boston/New Holland/Immingham

All of which had changed again significantly by 1970/71.

By that time 'B' covered the whole of King's Cross Division (other than
King's Cross itself), up to and including Peterborough - the evening down
commuter services were 2B39, formed of non-corridor stock, Type 2-hauled;
1B41, formed of Mk Is, Type 4-hauled and 2B43, formed of non-corridor stock,
Type 2-hauled.

'G' was being used for intra-regional Eastern Region specials, with 'Z' for
inter-regional ones.

plus (IIRC):

'D' was in use for Doncaster Division
'H' continued to be used for Hull
'J' was used for Sheffield Division
'L' remained in use for Leeds (including York)
'N' began to be used for Newcastle
'P' covered the March area

The general contraction continued over the years, with 'H' being
discontinued in favour of 'L' and many other changes - which I've long since
forgotten but probably got on paper somewhere!

[D7666]

Err surely it came in in 1960 not 1966 ?


LMR used both L and T for internal specials.


--
Nick

[Graeme Wall]

Post by D7666
Err surely it came in in 1960 not 1966 ?

Possibly, I was just going on what my book said, though it is a tad
imprecise.

Post by D7666
LMR used both L and T for internal specials.
--
Nick

[p***@btinternet.com]

Post by Graeme Wall

Post by D7666

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?
--
Clive

Not cities.
Back in time, the letters, apart from E M O S V (inter regionals
usually but not always) Z (specials *usually* inter regional specials)
X (as far as passegner trains concerned, royal train). BR SR for
example certainly used S in Kent while ISTR BR ScR Edin-Glas used O (I
think).
The other letters were not cities / towns / stations but usually [not
always] destination BR operating divisions thus B did not mean
destination Bristol but destination anywhere in Bristol division
likewise on WR A was London Division not just Paddington. On LMR A was
also London Division (WCML) not just euston and IIRC on ER London
division ECML not just Kings Cross. The same sort of principle applies
still today, just there are many more trains and the regions don't
exist.
These letters and even numbers to the extent of the first digit have
drifted in meaning over time, but a divisional legacy is traceable
through most of them, except where something wholly new has come on
the scene, like Eurostar or Thameslink or LO .
As usual with these things there was a general principle but no set
rule, you can find exceptions to prove rules however you look at this
subject, by number or by service or by location.
--
Nick

Interregional Trains
E Eastern Region (GN, GE & LT&S Lines)
M London Midland Region
N Eastern Region (NE lines)
O Southern Region
S Scottish Region
V Western Region
X Excursion and Special Trains
Western Region
A London Division
B Bristol Division (Bristol District)
C Bristol Division (Plymouth District)
F Cardiff Division (Swansea District)
T Cardiff Division (Cardiff District)
Z Excursion, Military and Special Trains running within the WR
London Midland Region
A London Division (LNW)
B London Division (GC & NL)
C London Division (Midland)
Manchester Division (North-LNW)
D Stoke-on-Trent Division (N Wales)
Nottingham Division (Nottingham)
F Nottingham Division (Leicester)
Liverpool Division
G Birmingham Division (LM)
H Birmingham Dividion (GW)
Manchester Division (South)
J Stoke-on-Trent Division (Shrewsbury)
Manchester Division (North-L&Y)
K Stoke-on-Trent Division (Stoke)
P Nottingham Division (Derby)
T Excursion & Special trains local to LMR
or freight on trip working
Z Special trains
Eastern Region (This gets complicated - Ed)
Common Letters
A ECML passenger trains
F Special train to the ECML not traversing LMR lines
T Cross London freight trip workings
X Royal Trains or out-of-gauge or exceptional loads
Z (Even numbers) Special trains local to the ER
Z (odd numbers) Special trains traversing LMR lines
North Eastern Lines
B York District
C Wakefield District
D Middlesbrough District
G Newcastle Division
H Hull Division
L Leeds Division
Great Northern Line
B Kings Cross/Hitchin/Cambridge
B Barnetby (exclusive)/Scunthorpe/Doncaster (exclusive)/
Hexthorpe Jn
C Hitchin (exclusive)/Grantham
D Doncaster Area (except where covered by B)
G Sheffield (GC) Area
H Sheffield (LM) Area/Tinsley Yard
J March/Boston/Lincoln/Newark (Castle)/
Bottesford (West)
K Firsby/Skegness/Louth
L Grimsby/Cleethorpes
P Boston/New Holland/Immingham
Great Eastern Line
A Guidea Park/Romford
B Brentwood/Shenfield/Chelsmford
C Peterborough/Whittlesea
C Ilford/Ilford CS
D Southend (Victoria)/Southminster branches
F Chelmsford (exclusive)/Ipswich (exclusive)
and branches (Except Chappel)
G Norwich/Sproughton/Bury (Exclusive)/Thetford/
Dereham (exclusive)
H Temple Mills/Stratford/North Woolwich/
Poplar/Spitalfields
J March/Wisbech/Boston/Lincoln/Newark (Castle)/
Bottesford (West)
K Ipswich/Lowestoft/Sheringham/Norwich (exclusive)
and branches
L Bishops Stortford (exclusive)/Hunstanton/Dereham/
Brandon/Bury (inclusive)/Marks Tey (exclusive)
M Enfield Town/Hackney Downs
N Chingford/Hackney Downs (exclusive)
O Broxbourne (exclusive)/Bishops Stortford via Edmonton
P Tottenham/Broxbourne/Hertford East via Lea Valley
S Broxbourne (exclusive)/Bishops Stortford via Lea Valley
V Cheshunt/Broxbourne/Hertford East via Edmonton
LT&S (Used numbers rather than letters)
1 Down trains via Upminster line
2 Up trains via Upminster line
3 Down trains via Tilbury line
4 Up trains via Tilbury line
5 Trains to and from East Ham depot
6 Down Tottenham & Hampstead trains terminating at Barking
All up Tottenham & Hampstead line trains
7 Ockenden branch
8 Up trains via Forest gate Jn
9 Trains terminating at Ripple Lane
Scottish Region
Glasgow Central, elsewhere only used 2-character codes
A Diesel Service via Larkfield
B Electric Service via Larkfield
C Diesel Service via Muirhead Jn & Circle Lines
D Diesel Service via Clydesdale Line at Shields Jn
E Electric Service via Muirhead Jn & Circle Lines
G Diesel Services via Glasgow, Barrhead & Kilmarnock Lines
H Diesel Service & Ayrshire Lines via Paisley Canal
K Diesel Service & Gourock or Wemyss Bay
L Electric Service & Gourock or Wemyss Bay
P Diesel Service & Ayrshire Lines via Paisley (Gilmour St)
T Diesel Service via City Lines at Sheilds Jn
Southern Region
2-character codes
7
From BR official staff magazine in mid sixties. "LMR Train Identification- Where are they heading?"

"The figure,letter,figure,figure headcode displayed on the front of locomotives and trains gives a simple and effective meansof identification. Reading from left to right the first character, a figure, denotes the type; the second character, a letter indicates the destination area or Region of the train. The third and fourth characters give the train identification numbers shown in the working timetable.
THE FIRST DIGIT INDICATES:-
1 EXPRESS PASSENGER
2 LOCAL PASSENGER
3 PARCELS & EMPTY STOCK
4, 5 AND 6 EXPRESS FREIGHT
7 EXPRESS FREIGHT NOT FITTED WITH AUTOMATIC BRAKE
8 THROUGH FREIGHT NOT FITTED WITH AUTOMATIC BRAKE
9 BRANCH OR STOPPING FREIGHT
0 LIGHT ENGINE(S). ENGINE & BRAKE

ON THE LMRTHE LETTER INDICATES;
A EUSTON
B EUSTON & RUGBY
C ST. PANCRAS & MARYLEBONE
D NOTTINGHAM OR CHESTER
E EASTERN REGION (INTER-REGIONAL TRAIN)
F LEICESTER
G BIRMINGHAM - WESTERN & MIDLAND LINES
H MANCHESTER SOUTH & STOKE-ON-TRENT
J MANCHESTER NORTH
K LIVERPOOL LIME STREET & CREWE, LIVERPOOL CENTRAL.
L BARROW, PRESTON (EXCL. FYLDE) & CARLISLE
M LONDON MIDLAND (INTER-REGIONAL TRAIN)
N NORTH EASTERN (INTER-REGIONAL TRAIN) [MY NOTE - UNTIL 1967]
O SOUTHERN REGION (INTER-REGIONAL TRAIN)
P BLACKPOOL & FYLDE, DERBY
S SCOTTISH REGION (INTER-REGIONAL TRAIN)
T EXCURSIONS & SPECIAL TRAINS LOCAL TO LMR
V WESTERN REGION (INTER-REGIONAL TRAIN)
X INTER-REGIONAL EXCURSIONS & SPECIAL TRAINS
Z EXCURSIONS & SPECIAL TRAINS LOCAL TO LMR

Post by Graeme Wall
--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.
Railway Miscellany at <http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail>

[amogles]

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E".   When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct?   If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?
--
Clive

Did the Southern Region also used 4-character codes, and if so, was
there any correlation between the 2-digit codes displayed on units and
the 4-character code? What about through-trains from the Southern to
other regions? What was displayed, for example, when a class 33
(having only a 2-digit display) worked through onto another region?

[D7666]

Post by amogles
Did the Southern Region also used 4-character codes, and if so, was
there any correlation between the 2-digit codes displayed on units and
the 4-character code? What about through-trains from the Southern to
other regions? What was displayed, for example, when a class 33
(having only a 2-digit display) worked through onto another region?

Yes

No

If it were booked a 33 (or 71 73 74) then the service/route got a 2
digit headcode e.g. the loco hauled Brighton Exeter until 1971 was (I
think) G6 both ways but the westbound was still1Vxx and the eastbound
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

All Waterloo -> anywhere on Salisbury line *west* of Basingstoke were
61 (rarely used) 62 63 for fast / semi / slow while the individual
trains would be 1Lxx (Salisbury Up or Down) ot xVxx SR to WR or xOxx
WR to SR. There was not even full correlation between 62 being 1xxx
and 63 2xxx. Remember the Sr codes were route codes, so 66 was not
just Reading Basingstoke but on to Salisbury as well, but locals
Basingstoke Salisbury would be 63 or 62. Likewise the hourly Waterloo
Basingstoke EMU stoppers were 63 even they they not go west of
Basingstoke (but alternated with the hourly 93 stoppers Waterloo
Bournemouth).

If a 33 worked off diagram I'm not clear what the official rule was
but 2 white blanks was normal. This does get complex as you then had
non-diagrammed use off 33s on routes that had codes because other
individual trains were diagrammed.

Going back in time there was also a series of dots and bars on top the
SR number blinds that indicated things like ''loco hauled train on
nominally EMU only route" etc they were quite complex.

Inter regional freight with 33s also had codes where booked 33s e.g.
good examples were bulk ballast moves from quarries to SR - HK was
Somerset Quarry - SR via Warminster Andover and Woking, or HJ same -
SR via (and think) Romsey, CC was Meldon to SR via Honiton and
Gillingham.

Digressing in 1970s most SR CCE ballast did come from Somerset Quarry
(up to 4 trains per day with Sealions etc) not Meldon (1 irregular Q
path per day and only Mermaids and 4w hoppers) despite a lot of
sources having you beleive it all came from Meldon. It was only when
ARC significantly expanded its own operations at Somerset (~~Whatley)
that Meldon resurged in late 1980s (when locos were sectorised and the
CCE got a big pool of 33s to work them). Quite a lot of images of 33s
clearly displaying HK (the majority flow) are publisehd captioned
Meldon trains but were not (the Meldon ran overnight anyway, less
likely to be pictured).


--
Nick

[amogles]

Thanks

[Graeme Wall]

Post by D7666
If it were booked a 33 (or 71 73 74) then the service/route got a 2
digit headcode e.g. the loco hauled Brighton Exeter until 1971 was (I
think) G6 both ways but the westbound was still1Vxx and the eastbound
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

G6 was Non-MU stock Brighton and Bournemouth

[D7666]

Post by Graeme Wall

Post by D7666
If it were booked a 33 (or 71 73 74) then the service/route got a 2
digit headcode e.g. the loco hauled Brighton Exeter until 1971 was (I
think) G6 both ways but the westbound was still1Vxx and the eastbound
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

G6 was Non-MU stock Brighton and Bournemouth
--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.
Railway Miscellany at <http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail>

G2 then

--
Nick

[Graeme Wall]

Post by D7666

Post by Graeme Wall

Post by D7666
If it were booked a 33 (or 71 73 74) then the service/route got a 2
digit headcode e.g. the loco hauled Brighton Exeter until 1971 was (I
think) G6 both ways but the westbound was still1Vxx and the eastbound
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

G6 was Non-MU stock Brighton and Bournemouth
--
Graeme Wall
This account not read, substitute trains for rail.
Railway Miscellany at<http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail>

G2 then

Yup, Brighton and Exeter St Davids.

[Peter Masson]

Post by amogles
Did the Southern Region also used 4-character codes, and if so, was
there any correlation between the 2-digit codes displayed on units and
the 4-character code? What about through-trains from the Southern to
other regions? What was displayed, for example, when a class 33
(having only a 2-digit display) worked through onto another region?

Yes

No
The basic rules were:
Passenger, Empty Passenger, or Locomotive hauled Van Trains over Multiple
Units Routes - Plain Numerals, e.g. 14
Locomotive hauled Passenger, Empty Passenger, or Van trains over routes not
covered by a Multiple Unit Headcode - Plain Letter/Numeral, e.g. A1 (an
example was the 0335 Victoria to Hastings News, which had headcode G2
Freight trains and Light locomotives - Numeral/Letter, e.g. 2G (An example
was the Mountfield Sidings to Northfleet Gypsum, headcode 4J).
Southern Region Locomotives working Inter-regional trains - two letters,
e.g. a train from Temple Mills to Sheerness, worked by a 73 from Hither
Green, displayed EB.

These from a 1976 WTT

Peter

[The Gardener]

Post by D7666
If it were booked a 33 (or 71 73 74) then the service/route got a 2
digit headcode e.g. the loco hauled Brighton Exeter until 1971 was (I
think) G6 both ways but the westbound was still1Vxx and the eastbound
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

11, IIRC.
Thanks for explaining this in detail - I recall the SEG A5 booklets
that listed all the headcodes - I think I still have one somewhere!
When I lived in Woking, I found it appropriate that the Weymouth fasts
had 91 as their headcode as they usually passed the station at a
similar number of mph.

One additional point: SR route codes divisible by 11 were generally
allocated to DEMU-operated routes, as in the days of stencil
headcodes, only one of each digit was carried in each cab, so trains
with stencils (all of which were EMUs) could not display headcodes
such as 11, 22 etc.

Apart from the codes in the Portsmouth/Southampton area, IIRC, the
DEMU codes were:

11 Brighton - Exeter
22 Charing Cross - Hastings (also, at one time, Victoria - Horsham
semi-fast, which was EMU)
33 Cannon Street - Hastings
44 not used (unless someone knows otherwise)
55 Reading - Tonbridge
66 Victoria - East Grinstead
77 London Bridge - East Grinstead
88 Victoria - Uckfield and Tonbridge - Reading
99 London Bridge - Uckfield (also, at one time, Staines - Woking which
was EMU)

Two exceptions to the multiples of 11 rule were Ashford - Hastings
(20) and Tonbridge - Eridge (31).

IIRC, the Portsmouth - Southampton codes were:

7x to/from Portsmouth and Southsea
8x to/from Portsmouth Harbour

x0 to/from Eastleigh or Reading
x5 to/from Southampton
x6 to/from Romsey
x7, x8 to/from Salisbury (both appeared to be used; was this to
distinguish semi-fast from slow trains?)
x9 to/from Bristol or beyond.

[D7666]

Post by The Gardener

Post by D7666
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

11, IIRC.

D'oh of course it was.

OK so I said G6 instead of G2 and 55 in place of 11, its all getting a
long while ago now.

Post by The Gardener
Thanks for explaining this in detail - I recall the SEG A5 booklets
that listed all the headcodes - I think I still have one somewhere!
When I lived in Woking, I found it appropriate that the Weymouth fasts
had 91

Through Wateroo trains anywhere on the Bournemouth line were :

90 Weymouth Quay
91 Weymouth fast
92 ditto semi
93 ditto slow

95 Soton E docks
96 Soton W docks
97 Lymington
98 Swanage

I'm not sure on this but I think 94 was possibly a Soton Terminus code
because the list might have got drawn up before closure.

:o)
Personally I'd liked to have seen boat trains and sea planes with 94
to Southampton Flying Boat Terminal
http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/s/southampton_flying_boat_terminal/index.shtml
:o)

Post by The Gardener
as their headcode as they usually passed the station at a
similar number of mph.

Indeed.

Post by The Gardener
One additional point: SR route codes divisible by 11 were generally
allocated to DEMU-operated routes, as in the days of stencil
headcodes, only one of each digit was carried in each cab, so trains
with stencils (all of which were EMUs) could not display headcodes
such as 11, 22 etc.

Interesting. I knew of the 11 multiples but never heard the stencil
explanation before.

Post by The Gardener
7x to/from Portsmouth and Southsea
8x to/from Portsmouth Harbour
x0 to/from Eastleigh or Reading
x5 to/from Southampton
x6 to/from Romsey
x7, x8 to/from Salisbury (both appeared to be used; was this to
distinguish semi-fast from slow trains?)
x9 to/from Bristol or beyond.

The detail of that group changed several times over time. From 1957
75-78/85-88 had covered Alton via Winchester and Andover via
Stockbridge as well.

--
Nick

[Graeme Wall]

Post by D7666

Post by The Gardener

Post by D7666
1Oxx. G6 was withdrawn when the service stopped completely for a while
- which it did - then got a differetn headcode when it went to DEMU
(55??).

11, IIRC.

D'oh of course it was.
OK so I said G6 instead of G2 and 55 in place of 11, its all getting a
long while ago now.

Post by The Gardener
Thanks for explaining this in detail - I recall the SEG A5 booklets
that listed all the headcodes - I think I still have one somewhere!
When I lived in Woking, I found it appropriate that the Weymouth fasts
had 91

90 Weymouth Quay
91 Weymouth fast
92 ditto semi
93 ditto slow
95 Soton E docks
96 Soton W docks
97 Lymington
98 Swanage
I'm not sure on this but I think 94 was possibly a Soton Terminus code
because the list might have got drawn up before closure.

No 94 listed in my book. It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

[D7666]

Post by D7666
I'm not sure on this but I think 94 was possibly a Soton Terminus code
because the list might have got drawn up before closure.

No 94 listed in my book.  It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

1966

Which is my point

That date make it probable it got allocated a number [for non electric
trains] prior to electric trains starting if closure was uncertain at
that planning stage but never used because it did close.

--
Nick

[Graeme Wall]

Post by D7666

Post by Graeme Wall

Post by D7666
I'm not sure on this but I think 94 was possibly a Soton Terminus code
because the list might have got drawn up before closure.

No 94 listed in my book. It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

1966
Which is my point
That date make it probable it got allocated a number [for non electric
trains] prior to electric trains starting if closure was uncertain at
that planning stage but never used because it did close.

Sounds likely.

[The Gardener]

No 94 listed in my book.  It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

1966 I think.

On the Central, 94 was (IIRC) Victoria - Epsom Downs via Mitcham
Junction. Don't know about the SE.

After Swanage closed, 98 was used for diversions via Laverstock and/or
Chandlers Ford.

[Pat O'Neill]

No 94 listed in my book. It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

1966 I think.

On the Central, 94 was (IIRC) Victoria - Epsom Downs via Mitcham
Junction. Don't know about the SE.

After Swanage closed, 98 was used for diversions via Laverstock and/or
Chandlers Ford.
Never worked 94, always did 92 Victoria - Epsom Downs via Selhurst

[Peter Masson]

Post by The Gardener

No 94 listed in my book. It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

1966 I think.
On the Central, 94 was (IIRC) Victoria - Epsom Downs via Mitcham
Junction. Don't know about the SE.

94 was Victoria to Margate (or stations short thereof) via Herne Hill,
Maidstone East, and Canterbury West.
98 was Victoria to Margate (or stations short thereof) via Herne Hill,
Maidstone East and Dover Priory.
There was a query about 44. In the 1980s it was used for Victoria to
Hastings via Herne Hill, Orpington and Battle - but seems to have been
reserved for loco-hauled trains, i.e. the Hastings News while it still ran./
It was also used for Charing Cross to Gravesend or Maidstone West via Parks
Bridge and Sidcup - the se division often used the same headcode twice, on
routes that did not conflict.

Peter

[D7666]

Post by Peter Masson

Post by The Gardener

No 94 listed in my book. It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

1966 I think.
On the Central, 94 was (IIRC) Victoria - Epsom Downs via Mitcham
Junction. Don't know about the SE.

94 was Victoria to Margate (or stations short thereof) via Herne Hill,
Maidstone East, and Canterbury West.
98 was Victoria to Margate (or stations short thereof) via Herne Hill,
Maidstone East and Dover Priory.
There was a query about 44. In the 1980s it was used for Victoria to
Hastings via Herne Hill, Orpington and Battle - but seems to have been
reserved for loco-hauled trains, i.e. the Hastings News while it still ran./
It was also used for Charing Cross to Gravesend or Maidstone West via Parks
Bridge and Sidcup - the se division often used the same headcode twice, on
routes that did not conflict.

We were really meaning on SWD.

--
Nick

[AnnieslandJohn]

Post by Peter Masson

No 94 listed in my book. It's the 5th edition which would make it circa
1970, when did Terminus close?

94 was Victoria to Margate (or stations short thereof) via Herne Hill,

Could this discussion be continued on page 94 ......

[Graeme Wall]

Post by The Gardener
One additional point: SR route codes divisible by 11 were generally
allocated to DEMU-operated routes, as in the days of stencil
headcodes, only one of each digit was carried in each cab, so trains
with stencils (all of which were EMUs) could not display headcodes
such as 11, 22 etc.

There's a house down the hill from me, 94 Bitterne Road, where the
number is displayed using the appropriate SR stencils. Must get a photo
of it.

[Graeme Wall]

Post by amogles

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers
ECML train I noticed that a train to kingsX is marked as "E". When I
was at Bristol, it was "A" London, "B" Bristol etc with each destination
having it's own letter apart from specials which normally carried a "Z".
Is the old system now defunct? If not what are the letters for the
headcodes of cities around the country?
--
Clive

Did the Southern Region also used 4-character codes, and if so, was
there any correlation between the 2-digit codes displayed on units and
the 4-character code? What about through-trains from the Southern to
other regions? What was displayed, for example, when a class 33
(having only a 2-digit display) worked through onto another region?

Interregional freights from the Southern used 2-character alphabetical
head-codes.

[Western Hero]

Post by amogles

Post by Clive
I know that the first number is the train class and the letter is the
destination and the last two the actual service, but watching bbarkers

Did the Southern Region also used 4-character codes, and if so, was
there any correlation between the 2-digit codes displayed on units and
the 4-character code? What about through-trains from the Southern to
other regions? What was displayed, for example, when a class 33
(having only a 2-digit display) worked through onto another region?

Back in the 60/70's when 33's worked Portsmouth Harbour - Cardiff
trains alongside Hymeks the headcode was 85, sometimes we had
specials, Merrymakers ? Headcodes i have in my notes that i can find
were 20 and 45.


milo