Railcards 'valid until:'

[u***@googlemail.com]

Railcards say 'valid until:'
Is it reasonable to assume they can be used on the date stated?

Yes.

Ian

[Charlie Hulme]

Railcards say 'valid until:'
Is it reasonable to assume they can be used on the date stated?

To travel, yes, but not necessarily to buy a ticket for
future use.

Charlie

[Mizter T]

Post by Charlie Hulme

Railcards say 'valid until:'
Is it reasonable to assume they can be used on the date stated?

To travel, yes, but not necessarily to buy a ticket for
future use.

Never really thought about doing that! If the Railcard had a little
while yet to run (e.g. a few weeks or days) and one was purchasing
tickets for travel after it had expired, I dare say that the ticket
clerk would be happy if you said you'd purchase one nearer to the date
of travel.

Of course a machine (be it through an online booking engine or a self-
service ticket machine) isn't going to ask to see your Railcard. One
could conceivably buy Railcard-discounted tickets online for use in a
couple of months and then buy the needed Railcard nearer the time of
travel.

Also, if a Railcard expires before a return journey is made using a
Railcard-discounted ticket (e.g. return portion of an Off-Peak Return
aka Saver Return) then obviously a passenger would be expected to
renew their Railcard before making the return journey. But I presume
it doesn't matter if there is a break in continuity before they
actually make their return journey - i.e. if there had been a time gap
between their old Railcard's expiry date and their new Railcard's
start date (same type of Railcard of course!). The Railcard T&Cs don't
mention anything about this situation, so I assume that in this
scenario the rules happily coincide with common-sense!

[Jonathan Morton]

Post by Mizter T
Of course a machine (be it through an online booking engine or a self-
service ticket machine) isn't going to ask to see your Railcard. One
could conceivably buy Railcard-discounted tickets online for use in a
couple of months and then buy the needed Railcard nearer the time of
travel.

Yes, that's perfectly OK.

Post by Mizter T
Also, if a Railcard expires before a return journey is made using a
Railcard-discounted ticket (e.g. return portion of an Off-Peak Return
aka Saver Return) then obviously a passenger would be expected to
renew their Railcard before making the return journey. But I presume
it doesn't matter if there is a break in continuity before they
actually make their return journey - i.e. if there had been a time gap
between their old Railcard's expiry date and their new Railcard's
start date (same type of Railcard of course!). The Railcard T&Cs don't
mention anything about this situation, so I assume that in this
scenario the rules happily coincide with common-sense!

Actually it isn't necessarily common sense. If the first railcard expires on
25 January and you buy a return on 24 January (valid until 23 Feb), renew
your railcard on 22 Feb and use the return half then, you'll probably get
away with it - but it's far from common sense. There's an argument that once
the ticket becomes unusable (with the expiry of the first railcard) then it
can't miraculously resurrect itself. I just don't know the answer to that
one.

Regards

Jonathan

[Peter Campbell Smith]

Post by Jonathan Morton
Actually it isn't necessarily common sense. If the first railcard
expires on 25 January and you buy a return on 24 January (valid until
23 Feb), renew your railcard on 22 Feb and use the return half then,
you'll probably get away with it - but it's far from common sense.

I have just done that, and nobody complained. The new railcard doesn't
say when the old one expired, so the gripper wouldn't be able to tell
there was a gap. I bought the new railcard from a different TOC from
the old one, and short of a fairly forensic review of computer logs, I
doubt that anyone could correlate the two cards and prove there was a
gap.

I have also in the past bought a ticket online in advance, and then
bought the railcard on arrival at the station, and again nobody has
complained.

I've just checked the Ts and Cs on the (senior) railcard form, and it
says that 'when buying tickets you must show the railcard' and 'on your
journey ... you must show a ... valid railcard'. However it doesn't say
they have to be the same railcard, and in any case when you buy online
or from a machine you are not asked, eg, for the railcard number or even
asked to confirm that you have one.

So I reckon that the requirement is that (a) you have to have a railcard
valid at the time of use of the ticket for each part of the journey and
(b) you have to be able to demonstrate that if you buy the ticket at a
ticket office.

Peter

[Bob Martin]

Post by Peter Campbell Smith

Post by Jonathan Morton
Actually it isn't necessarily common sense. If the first railcard
expires on 25 January and you buy a return on 24 January (valid until
23 Feb), renew your railcard on 22 Feb and use the return half then,
you'll probably get away with it - but it's far from common sense.

I have just done that, and nobody complained. The new railcard doesn't
say when the old one expired, so the gripper wouldn't be able to tell
there was a gap. I bought the new railcard from a different TOC from
the old one, and short of a fairly forensic review of computer logs, I
doubt that anyone could correlate the two cards and prove there was a
gap.
I have also in the past bought a ticket online in advance, and then
bought the railcard on arrival at the station, and again nobody has
complained.
I've just checked the Ts and Cs on the (senior) railcard form, and it
says that 'when buying tickets you must show the railcard' and 'on your
journey ... you must show a ... valid railcard'. However it doesn't say
they have to be the same railcard, and in any case when you buy online
or from a machine you are not asked, eg, for the railcard number or even
asked to confirm that you have one.
So I reckon that the requirement is that (a) you have to have a railcard
valid at the time of use of the ticket for each part of the journey and
(b) you have to be able to demonstrate that if you buy the ticket at a
ticket office.

I have never been asked to show my senior railcard on the train. Of course,
one look at me may tell the inspector that I probably have one!

[tony]

Railcard connected query, and maybe a really dumb one! A Norfolk day
ranger (or whatever it is called) offers a national railcard discount,
If I have a family and friends railcard do I still need to have a
child with me to purchase one at a discount, as the child has no
railcard discount applied to his/her rover. Is it just by virtue I
have a national railcard suffice? It may seem a dumb question but
actually reads that a railcard holder gets a discount?
cheers Tony
Sorry to the OP for hijacking his thread but the first reply seemed
fairtly final.

[m***@asda17.fsnet.co.uk]

 Railcard connected query, and maybe a really dumb one!  A Norfolk day
ranger (or whatever it is called) offers a national railcard discount,
If I have a family and friends railcard do I still need to have a
child with me to purchase one at a discount, as the child has no
railcard discount applied to his/her rover. Is it just by virtue I
have a national railcard suffice? It may seem a dumb question but
actually reads that a railcard holder gets a discount?
  cheers  Tony
  Sorry to the OP for hijacking his thread but the first reply seemed
fairtly final.

Yes you would need at least 1 child to travel with you to use the
discounted Anglia Plus Day Ranger.

[John Salmon]

Railcards say 'valid until:'
Is it reasonable to assume they can be used on the date stated?

Yes, I believe so. I bought my railcard on the 11th April 2008 and it says
'Valid until 10 APR 09', implying 'up to and including'.

Incidentally, the print quality on my railcard is so poor that the number
cannot now be read. On Tuesday, this prevented the LU ticket office at
King's Cross St. Pancras from enabling my Oyster card to benefit from the
lower daily cap, as loading the railcard number is apparently a key part of
the process.

[Mizter T]

Post by John Salmon

Railcards say 'valid until:'
Is it reasonable to assume they can be used on the date stated?

Yes, I believe so. I bought my railcard on the 11th April 2008 and it says
'Valid until 10 APR 09', implying 'up to and including'.
Incidentally, the print quality on my railcard is so poor that the number
cannot now be read. On Tuesday, this prevented the LU ticket office at
King's Cross St. Pancras from enabling my Oyster card to benefit from the
lower daily cap, as loading the railcard number is apparently a key part of
the process.

Interesting. What happens when Railcards are replaced because of loss,
theft or because the print has worn off or similar damage - is the
replacement Railcard issued with a new number or with the same number
as the old one?

*If* it is a different number, and *if* the Railcard number is loaded
on the Oyster card, then an Oyster card loaded with the discount would
no longer correlate with a replacement Railcard.

Of course just because the LU ticket office needs to record the number
of the Railcard does not mean that number is subsequently stored on
the Oyster card itself, it may simply be stored on the Oyster central
database along with the other information for that particular Oyster
card. The only thing that *has* to be stored on the Oyster card itself
is the expiry date of the Railcard.