Thameslink to GN

[Roland Perry]

According to signage at stations in Cambs, work will be done over Easter
to connect Thameslink to GN. The tunnels to SPILL were done a few years
ago, so this must be the pointwork into the ECML just north of Kings
Cross.

Mainline services (as well as FCC) are terminating at Finsbury Park for
the duration.

[Recliner]

Post by Roland Perry
According to signage at stations in Cambs, work will be done over Easter
to connect Thameslink to GN. The tunnels to SPILL were done a few years
ago, so this must be the pointwork into the ECML just north of Kings Cross.
Mainline services (as well as FCC) are terminating at Finsbury Park for the duration.

That's interesting though I think it'll still be several years before
through trains run. I wonder if the track in the connecting tunnels has
been laid yet? Maybe this imminent work is on the tunnel connection rather
than the points?

[Paul Corfield]

On Tue, 15 Apr 2014 15:49:49 -0500, Recliner

Post by Recliner

Post by Roland Perry
According to signage at stations in Cambs, work will be done over Easter
to connect Thameslink to GN. The tunnels to SPILL were done a few years
ago, so this must be the pointwork into the ECML just north of Kings Cross.
Mainline services (as well as FCC) are terminating at Finsbury Park for the duration.

That's interesting though I think it'll still be several years before
through trains run. I wonder if the track in the connecting tunnels has
been laid yet? Maybe this imminent work is on the tunnel connection rather
than the points?

The work has been ongoing for months and months. This is not the first
closure affecting the line into KX. I understand the tracks have been
laid in the tunnel and work is progressing on points, signalling and
electrification. I believe the connection will be used when the new
depot at Hornsey is operational and Class 700s are needed for service.
Pass services through the new link don't start until 2018.

http://www.londonreconnections.com/2013/east-coast-mainline-routes-branches-part-1-thameslink-works/

[happy to be corrected if I've got any of the above wrong]

[Roland Perry]

Post by Paul Corfield
I believe the connection will be used when the new
depot at Hornsey is operational and Class 700s are needed for service.
Pass services through the new link don't start until 2018.

So only 18 years late then!

Post by Paul Corfield
http://www.londonreconnections.com/2013/east-coast-mainline-routes-branches-part-1-thameslink-works/

"At Finsbury Park Station, the 12-car extension of platforms 3 and 5 has
already been completed. These platforms will cater for Thameslink fast
services through to Cambridge."

But I thought the 2tph fast services would continue to terminate at
Kings Cross, and only the 1+1tph semi-fast and slows feed belong to the
Thameslink service.

[D7666]

Post by Roland Perry
But I thought the 2tph fast services would continue to terminate at
Kings Cross, and only the 1+1tph semi-fast and slows feed belong to the
Thameslink service.

Surely, because the pattern of linked services through Thameslink core is still NOT finalised the non-TL servcies are also not fixed yet ?

TL core 16 TPH (peak) to Midland and 8 TPH (peak) to GN, and (IIRC) a requirement to maintain minimum 4 TPH linked Bedford Brighton, is fixed, but not much more ? Where the others go with what cross London linkage, and with what stopping pattern is not finally decided, and AFAIK it is up to the winning bidder of the combined TSGN franchise to determine.

Hence, if they have not determined what the TL core services pattern of stops outside the core is, they can't have finalised what the non TL pattern to KX is since they are inexorably linked.

--
Nick

[Roland Perry]

Post by D7666

Post by Roland Perry
But I thought the 2tph fast services would continue to terminate at
Kings Cross, and only the 1+1tph semi-fast and slows feed belong to the
Thameslink service.

Surely, because the pattern of linked services through Thameslink core
is still NOT finalised the non-TL servcies are also not fixed yet ?

You'd better tell that to the people at the DfT who issued the TSGN ITT
with a map of the through services with frequencies annotated.

Post by D7666
TL core 16 TPH (peak) to Midland and 8 TPH (peak) to GN, and (IIRC) a
requirement to maintain minimum 4 TPH linked Bedford Brighton, is
fixed, but not much more ?

The ITT shows 2tph to Cambridge, which by wide agreement are the slow
and semi-fast services [but not including the fasts which emulate
semi-fasts in the rush hour].

Post by D7666
Where the others go with what cross London linkage, and with what
stopping pattern is not finally decided, and AFAIK it is up to the
winning bidder of the combined TSGN franchise to determine.

It may be the case that the franchisee has to decide whether (eg)
Peterborough services go to Brighton, and Cambridge to Horsham [or vice
versa] but the franchise spec will have determined the stopping patterns
for London to Brighton/Horsham/Peterborough/Cambridge.

Post by D7666
Hence, if they have not determined what the TL core services pattern of
stops outside the core is, they can't have finalised what the non TL
pattern to KX is since they are inexorably linked.

It appears to be in the ECML ITT (for GN), as pointed out by Ian Bidwell
in another thread.

[Theo Markettos]

Post by Recliner
That's interesting though I think it'll still be several years before
through trains run. I wonder if the track in the connecting tunnels has
been laid yet? Maybe this imminent work is on the tunnel connection rather
than the points?

I understand it was originally planned to integrate it when the ECML is
resignalled with ERTMS, but that's not going to happen in time so there will
be a stopgap installation. Even that doesn't sound quick.

On a purely practical note, I'd have thought it would make sense to put the
junction in once the branch is laid. Otherwise a failure of point clips
would direct trains down a tunnel with no track. It also makes it easier to
test. Though the schedule may dictate otherwise.

Theo

[D7666]

Post by Theo Markettos

Post by Recliner
rather
than the points?

, I'd have thought it would make sense to put the
junction in once the branch is laid. Otherwise a failure of point clips
would direct trains down a tunnel with no track. It also makes it easier to
test.

At the south end of the tunnel i.e. just north of St Pancras Intl LL , the points from Thameslink core to GN have been in place for some time, at least a year I think now, possibly maybe 2 years.

I don't know what they are doing further north on the GN works.

IMHO talking about failing point clips is nonsense. It is not far off wanting a man with a red flag to walk in front of every train.

--
Nick

[Roland Perry]

In message

, at 15:49:49 on Tue, 15 Apr 2014, Recliner

Post by Roland Perry
According to signage at stations in Cambs, work will be done over Easter
to connect Thameslink to GN. The tunnels to SPILL were done a few years
ago, so this must be the pointwork into the ECML just north of Kings Cross.
Mainline services (as well as FCC) are terminating at Finsbury Park for the duration.

That's interesting though I think it'll still be several years before
through trains run. I wonder if the track in the connecting tunnels has
been laid yet? Maybe this imminent work is on the tunnel connection rather
than the points?

I don't remember the exact wording on the poster at the station, but I
think I caught the essence of it above.

[G***@live.co.uk]

Post by Roland Perry
In message

, at 15:49:49 on Tue, 15 Apr 2014, Recliner

Post by Roland Perry
According to signage at stations in Cambs, work will be done over Easter
to connect Thameslink to GN. The tunnels to SPILL were done a few years
ago, so this must be the pointwork into the ECML just north of Kings Cross.
Mainline services (as well as FCC) are terminating at Finsbury Park for the duration.

That's interesting though I think it'll still be several years before
through trains run. I wonder if the track in the connecting tunnels has
been laid yet? Maybe this imminent work is on the tunnel connection rather
than the points?

I don't remember the exact wording on the poster at the station, but I
think I caught the essence of it above.
--
Roland Perry

Last weekend's work was preparatory - to relocate existing pointwork and associated civils works to accommodate the new junction. The next major blockade is 31 May/1 June and I believe this is to install the new junction.

[Roland Perry]

Post by G***@live.co.uk

Post by Roland Perry
I don't remember the exact wording on the poster at the station, but I
think I caught the essence of it above.

Last weekend's work was preparatory - to relocate existing pointwork and associated civils works to accommodate the new junction. The next
major blockade is 31 May/1 June and I believe this is to install the new junction.

As it happens I was at the station this morning and saw the poster again
(it's still there). It talked about "joining" the two lines, so would
cover any of the above.